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Cult Cigars Sampler Contest!

by Bryan Glynn, November 4, 2013
  • Cigar And Pipes Smokin' Deals

img_2818_medThis time around we have a beautiful Cult Cigars Sampler including the new Profile up for grabs 🙂 I have reviewed a couple from their line already including one vitola of the Profile so definitely check those out to learn more about how they smoke. To enter all you need to do is tell me about what appeals to you most about a cigar’s band. What have you run across that works well or what doesn’t? Comment below with your answer, share with the buttons and tell me which you did. A random winner will be picked in about a week to enjoy the fine smokes! All entrants must be of legal smoking age in their state and have a US mailing address. Good luck!

  • bluesmanhop

    I like a band that clearly lets me know what I’m smoking, has some good graphics to add to my collection, but not overly glued requiring a lot of work to take it off. I really hate when taking off the band the wrap comes up with it. Shared.

    • bluesmanhop

      Sorry shared on FB and Twitter both.

  • Leo Steelfire

    I really appreciate the simple bands. Nice bold words with fine bordering; and it has to be pretty wide, not some little thin scrap of paper.

    Shared on Facebook.

  • smokethis

    I really like the lettering and the colors of the band gives it a very cool look..

    • smokethis

      Also on FB.

  • FTG2Voge

    Nicely executed artwork appeals to me the most on a band.

    • FTG2Voge

      Shared on FB

  • Camshaft83

    Shared on FB
    I like a band that has good artwork and gives the brand name along with the name of the blend. I hate having to look up pics so I can remember which cigar is which because only the color of the band is different. I also like when they take an extra second to apply the band like they actually care about the product.

  • Richard

    I like most of the bands and enjoy the variety in designs. The only things I don’t like is when the glue is so good it doesn’t come off easy or if it takes some of the wrapper with it.

    Shared on Facebook

  • marty76

    eye catching bands with nice colors and artwork are always good. i hate when there is a huge band that covers most of the cigar. i am always afraid of whats underneath those huge bands. shared on goolgle+.

  • Tommz81

    Shared on google +.

    I like it simple. Just tell me what I’m smoking. And do away with glue. Self adhesive is the only way.

  • rockjock

    I like a band the gives information on the maker and make of the cigar. It should be easy to come off without risking damage to the cigar. From a design standpoint I like bands that are embossed and have have shape. Sized about .75 to 1.5 inches high at the widest point. Shared on FB.

  • dwtate5

    I like old fashioned looking bands and boxes (black and white pinstripes). Easy to say names with maybe a little humor in the name.
    shared facebook/google +

  • sparkmark

    I enjoy cigar art. I like the old school colorful bands with faux gold medal awards. It is very important for me to have the cigar band stay on one place and slide around while I am smoking it. It is also important for the cigar band to cleaning pop apart when I reach the band.

    • sparkmark

      Correction: … stay in one place and not slide around while I am smoking it

  • sparkmark

    Liked on facebook

  • Texvet

    I like simple, easy to read bands. More importantly, names I can pronounce!

    Liked FB

  • ptyler

    It doesn’t have to do much…tell me the name of the cigar and has to be easy to get off so as not to damage the wrapper or require me to have razor sharp nails…and like a previous comment…stay in place while smoking.

    • ptyler

      Shared on FB

  • MorganGeo

    I like a cigar band that at the bare minimum puts their name on it. I can’t tell you how many times I have had a great smoke and never knew what I was smoking. I would have loved to pick up some more but I had no way of knowing what I had. I also love a band that is medium in size. What I mean is not covering the whole stick and one that is not one simple little band.

    Shared on Fb

  • Gary

    I like to try new cigars. You Web site haas recommended many of my new favorite cigars.

    When shopping for a new cigar, I will look for an interesting, colorful and artful design.

    I have found the Ashton VSG and Corona Gold by purchasing a cigar based on the label.

    I am cautious of cigars with too big a label.

  • smoke dogg

    I like a band which is easy to read, has decent art work with bold colors. Shared on facebook.

  • chief791

    I like big Graphic cigars bands, San Cristobal and Ave Maria are 2 of the best.

  • sazze18

    I appreciate bands that apply the same creativity, care and uniqueness as I would imagine they would making the cigar. Man O’ War & Ave Maria are beautiful. Gurkha’s are cool, but I’d like to see more differentiation between all the blends. Some of the Alec Bradley’s are eye catching. I like Obsidian, because from the magazine it looks like its wrapped up in electrical tape, and that’s different. I’m not a fan of Camacho’s new band..I think it’s not as classy and the old one. Not a big fan of the Acid bands either, up close it looks like they could have been made at home with a label-maker.

  • A cigars band has a huge influence on me. If the band is eye-catching, I am almost certain to buy at least one, and give it a shot. The Santos de Miami is the first one that comes to mind. I had the lancero and the band is just amazing. The colors, the coloring of the band and they way it sits on the cigar is all perfect, for catching my eye.

    FB’d, Tweeted & +1’d 🙂

  • jacklshelton

    What typically catches my eye on a band is a bold design or unique font. I also tend to notice darker colors most, bright colors second and white or neutral colors last. Some of the most memorable bands include Foundry, Obsidian, Man O’ War and the Camacho Blackout.

  • ABrooks80

    This is awesome I am attracted to a cigar where the band matches the name, type and uniqueness of the cigar I like vibrant colors and when the band has some shine. But most of all when I can remove it without destroying the cigar or risk ruining it. Thanks for the contest Bryan.

    Shared on Facebook!

  • pato1001

    I personally like really brightly colored and very ornate looking bands. One of my favorite’s is the Opus-X band. I tend to not be as interested if the band looks too plain or cheap or boring. Tweeted.

  • RamzaFreak20

    I love the thickness. Theres a joke somewhere… but the thickness of the band is important. Say, if you had a band like Ave Maria, but it was made out of thin paper with bad dye, it wouldnt be as appealing as the thick metallic band thats on them now.


  • ncapoccia14

    I like a band that is artistically pleasing. I also like one that has the brand name, and the name of the blend as well on it. One must have quality is that the band is easily removed to reduce the risk of damaging the wrapper. Shared via twitter.

  • wm2slc

    Well I just looked at my latest box of bands. Looks like I am attracted to cigars with bands darker in color highlighted in gold. AF Anejo, LFD, Four Kicks, 7-20-4 and JdN 1970 and Dark Corojo.

    Tweeted and Shared to a couple of FB pages!

  • chad1955

    I prefer bands that are not too big (no more than about 1″ – 1 1/2″ in width). I like the adhesive types over the glued varieties. The cigar name and maker should be legible and with a good mix of color. Monochromatic bands or grey bands are boring. Color catches my eye. Embossed bands are better than printed because it indicates to me that the maker made a commitment to the cigar. Prefer single bands over multiple and like to avoid foot bands.

    Will share on FB, Twitter and Google.

    • chad1955

      Caveat to my previous comment: when I say I like embossed bands I don’t mean the over the top glittery types but ones that try to exemplify the maker or cigar types. Most plain printed bands are fine but when a maker has tons of types (like Gurkha, e.g.) it helps to have some sort of demarcation and that is usually done via a bit of more elaborate moniker. The types I don’t care for, as an example, would be the Ave Maria’s. Those only seem costly and unnecessarily ornate…

  • TacticalStogie

    Cigar bands are purely for marketing and have a great value in today’s market. Fewer people buy boxes of cigars as they once did and are buying singles of multiple brands. Here is where I feel the cigar band comes into play for two reasons:
    A) The band should be appealing to the eye. The eye should be able to easy pick up on the band while you are walking through a humidor filled with hundreds or thousands of different cigars. This is a staple of any marketing technique.
    B) Since people store multiple brands of cigars in their person table top humidor the band makes it easy to identify the cigar of your choosing. Without the band in place most people couldn’t tell the difference between most cigars visually.

    Before bands were introduced, the box was the only identifier. Hints why there have been so many beautiful boxes put to market. Some of these boxes could be considered art work.

    Some cigar branding has gone over the top in recent years. I have been guilty of buying a cigar because of its pretty band only to be disappointed with the taste and quality of construction. I personally feel some of these companies put all their money into marketing and make some sweet looking band because they can’t actually produce a decent cigar.

    Some don’ts:
    Colors: Keep the colors simple, but not dull. Make sure the colors don’t easily blend together from 3 feet away.
    Size: Stop already with supper wide bands they you have to take of just to get past the first third.
    Application: Easy with damn glue. Nothing irritates me worse to remove the band and take a chuck out of my wrapper
    Legible: Pretty self explanatory.. If I cant read what the hell I am smoking how can I tell a friend and encourage him/her to try in out.

    So there is my 2 cents
    Shared to FB…

    • TacticalStogie

      Wow!! I should proof read my post for submitting them!! Please disregard all the spelling errors and MISSING words. I guess I get really excited about cigar bands..

  • HardlyClerkin

    Shared on Twitter

    I love bands with the most information, I mean fancy logos are nice but I want to know what I am smoking. Sometimes I am gifted things or buy things that sit in my humidor for a while I won’t remember what exactly it is when I pull it out again

  • rpharmrx

    If you have a theme or name that is part of an advertising promo to get a buyer’s attention, make sure the band carries through on this concept. While you smoke the cigar it’s the band you see, not the box! It must be colorful and easy to remove safely.

  • kevinhen16

    Of course the biggest turn off for a band is if it is glued to the wrapper, but almost goes without saying.

    Other than that, I enjoy unique bands that let me know the brand of the cigar before even reading what is written on the band. I think some companies due a great job of this just with their shape, font, and color scheme, while others have more cookie-cutter bands that use the same gold-black, blue-yellow, or white-green color schemes with a basic cursive font.

    I don’t know the exact reason, but there is something about Onyx bands that I have always enjoyed.

    Shared on Facebook.

    • Mandobro

      I like how an intricate piece of artwork can be squeezed in such a small space.

  • puffrey

    I like a band that has a classic look to it. Nothing overly fancy, brand name, a bit of simple design and a touch of subtle color.


    I just wish all manufacturers would put their name, the name of the cigar & the size on every stick. And please make it large enough to be easily read, I ain’t getting any younger ya know!

  • quackaddict94


    A fancy, yet easy to read band is important. It doesn’t have to be an exquisite design, just something that grabs the eye. No more than two however. I’ve had cigars recently with 3+ bands and it just becomes too much. Also having the bands that are self adhesive rather than having globs of glue. I don’t like gimmick bands like the “Sons of Anarchy” or “Black Ops” joke cigars that are out there.

  • Kalven

    I agree with many here: Simple, but with some info. NOT TOO MUCH GLUE (are you listening, A. Fuente?)

    • Kalven


  • vwarnerjr

    A nice looking band sets off my interest to investigate a new cigar, but as others have said sometimes they put too much glue and it tears the wrapper when you take it off. Other times the only good thing about the cigar was the band. shared on facebook/twitter/google+

  • lostonmonday

    I dig bands with a little depth to them… literally. For instance, I just picked up an Oliva O. The “Oliva” and “O” are raised.
    Gold doesn’t float my boat, but I think it works very nicely on cigar bands. LGC’s Gilded Age bands would look way nicer if the Gilded Age was embossed, and the little lines were embossed and gold, well, at least I think so.
    I’m also in the “love Ave Maria bands” club, and for sure in the “don’t use so much freaking glue the band and wrapper become one” group. Tweeted

  • micktorres

    I love cigar bands because they are a great conversation piece, Shared on FB.

  • mufdvr6976

    I liked ,, I like bold plain to the point not too much colors simple! thanks!

  • gvarsity

    I like a couple of kinds of bands either the classic busy bands like Diamond Crown Maximus or the minimalist bands like Tatuaje or Davidoff. What I really hate are the ones that try to be artsy and hip and look like some kind of hipster bar logo.

  • MongoJay

    As much as we like to say we are not susceptible to marketing I think we’ve all been in the B&M or online and picked something up to try just because it looks cool.

    Simple is great, but there is no excuse for lack of creativity. When I see a band with red initials in a white oval outlined in black, and everything in Times New Roman or Arial from Microsoft word, I’ll tend to not even realize it was there. Same goes for most cigars with brown, or matte gold/yellow bands, or a boring crown which seems to decorate about a hundred different cigars. Ask Xikar. They might still be making solid and affordable smokes if the designed their band a little more like Gurkha and less like a gas station value smoke.

    One brand that keeps it simple, yet made a creativei cigar band is Fratello. It’s black, white and red block letters, but the barber pole design is eye catching and still remain classic.

    There is nothing wrong with big designs. As long as the glue doesn’t interfere with the cigar, I say go for it. Gurkha has some fun with their bands, the Ghost hologram band is one of my personal favorites. Alec Bradley Tempus, Prensado, and New York have large and very regal looking bands. And of course some of us would wallpaper our homes with Opus X bands if if were financially feasible. Did I mention shiny? Yeah, I’m a big child. Shiny is good.

  • Michael Cabot

    A band that does not ruin a cigar with a big glob of glue. Shared on Facebook

  • bv4jv

    I have 2 criteria, easy to remove and wrapped around something delicious.

    Posted to facebook

  • bwehmann1

    The band is the first thing I notice. Being a graphic designer it kills me if I see a band with bad typography. It drives me crazy, bad kerning for example, although even if the band has bad type I’m still down to try it out if the wrapper, smell and overall looks of the actual cigar appeal to me. I liked on Facebook.

  • William G.

    I love a classy band like the pardon 64 or the Olivia v bands, keep it simple and not a ton of glue on it . Liked on fb

  • I like bands within the half-inch to 1-inch size. Anything bigger can become a hassle to remove and it also means I have to remove it sooner. There’s also a possibility that you’ll get more glue on the wrapper with larger bands.

    As for the designs, I really like Cult’s approach, their first band is very unique, it’s selective colored and minimalistic but it also has the subtleties of the red that pop out and make it identifiable.

  • Chaz

    I tend to gravitate toward more traditional, classy kinds of bands. I love the history of cigars, and like to think of shared experiences over the years when I see a traditional band. The blend itself is most important, but if I had a choice, I would prefer the bands to be understated and classic.

    FB liked 🙂

  • sdh3237

    I like simple bands like the bands that Padron uses on their cigars. I also like elegant bands like on the My Father Flor de Antilles cigars.

  • BArmstrongNY

    I like a classic band. One that is not too gaudy. Ashton is simple, Erin Go Bragh is done well. Too much in a band could mean not enough in the cigar.

  • willigeo02

    Fancy bands used on La Aroma De Cuba EE, Ashton VSG are great. Padron Family Reserve 1964 and Oliva V Melanio w/ smaller double bands are nice. I’m not too crazy about the small simple bands like what’s used on Sancho Panza Caballero or Padron 5000. Great cigars though. You can’t judge a cigar by the band.


  • cjordanhouston

    A cigar band should be able to tell the history of the maker along with the quality of the smoke. You should see a label and know quality

    • cjordanhouston

      o yea and shared on FB/Twitter

  • Bullet20

    I usually look for descriptions and ask questions when I am looking for a “new” smoke. Sometimes I realize there are some visual things like size, name brand and color that attract a person, but I will not buy without information. Of course I am always looking at past cigar reviews here on CO to help me decide.

    I have shared on twitter!

  • skalls

    I like the following:
    1) 1 Band that comes off easily.
    2) legible writing that includes the company and line.
    3) less than a 1\4 of the cigar in length.

    I don’t like multiple bands, bands that damage the cigar, and unreadable bands.

  • michaelb827

    I like a label that is unique, color,design and artwork is important to me. Size.. the bigger the better,,However, I do not buy a cigar just for the lable only, I do my research on quality first…if I have seen or read a good review, I will purchase that cigar with the best flavor over one with a great label…I have purchased many great cigars that have a average labels and enjoyed them immensely,,,but wished that they had a label and box that matched their quality.

  • Hicksbuilt

    Being very new to cigars, I like a band that tells me exactly what brand, version, and size that I am smoking, so I will remember if I like it or not. Shared on twitter as @I_hicks

  • jstndowers

    When it comes to cigar bands, i like to see unique colors that stand out. Drew Estate’s Acid line captures this perfectly. The bands are incredibly simple but colorful as well as including an identifier band for the model. Something i don’t enjoy seeing are cartoony bands that are oversimplified.
    One brand i appreciate most for their bands are Romeo y Julieta of their consistent color scheme, while changing layout from stick to stick keeping it fresh.
    Shared via twitter @jstndowers

  • nyccigarlover

    I really like the intricacy of some bands and how much detail goes into them. I also like seeing how a band can accentuate the actual wrapper of the cigar. An example that comes to mind is the La Aroma de Cuba Mi Amor Reserva and how it has that beautiful band with the painting of a lady accompanied by that vibrant red, blue and yellow against the dark maduro wrapper. It’s really a beautiful cigar to look at.

    What I hate most about bands is when they’re difficult to peel off and/or damage the cigar.

    Shared on Facebook.

  • Don

    Personally, I like cigar bands (and artwork, for that matter) to have a unique style to it. I like bands that have an art deco or an old time feel to it, such as The La Gloria Cubana Guilded Age cigar.

  • FULL name of the company along with FULL name of the particular cigar. Half the time I don’t know what the heck I’m smoking! Oh, and make it pretty.

  • Joseph Szeremet

    I love cigar band art. In the current market there are a lot of new and innovative ways that cigars are being packaged. I personally love seeing bands that have a cohesive theme to help sell the mystique of a new cigar. I do get very tired of the old Cuban designs. Cuba has been out of the American market for along time, and probably for a long time to come. Time to move on. One more pet peeve of mine is gold. Enough with the gold. I understand the concept of marketing “affluence”, and “luxury” (which is a bit overdone in my opinion) but enough with all the damn gold. I tweeted!

  • Brent

    I like the detail art that goes into cigar bands. The embossing on a band is something I admire too.

  • reckless

    The artwork for sure. I like when companies get creative with it. For example Gurkha band artwork is so good I would be drawn to it on a shelf without knowing what brand it was. On the other hand I can appreciate the classic elegant look that a R&J band gives off. Nice bands draw the eye.

    Shared through g+

  • Davomak

    My wife and I were just discussing this the other night. There is nothing at all wrong with intricately detailed bands, but I prefer a simpler, more elegant design in a band. Some examples of what I mean would be the Man o War Puro Authentico, black band with a golden Man o War logo; and the Graycliff Casillero Privada, white band with minimal texture and the name of the cigar in navy blue script. Maybe I’m just boring, but that type of design appeals to me.

  • VWCC2013

    When it comes to cigar bands the KISS rule applies for me (Keep It Simple Stupid). I prefer bands that don’t cover up half or more of the cigar. For me all I look for in a band’s design is for it to tell me the manufacturer and sometimes what cigar it is. Some examples would be the Padron Series’ bands, Rocky Patel’s bands on The Edge and Vintage Series. I also want it to be self-adhesive and not rip the wrapper to shreds when I take it off or not require long nails to take it off. Something I don’t really look for, but is a bonus is if the band’s color/artwork look good on the cigar. Two bands that instantly comes to my mind that has good looking artwork and is simple is the Arturo Fuente Gran Reserva and Chateau Fuente bands.

    Share on Facebook

  • Lunchbox

    What appeals to me in a cigar band. for one there has to be some contrast I always find myself drawn to dark maduros with a bold red band on them. also in my opinion the bigger the band the better the Alec Bradley black market have those huge covers basically. lastly I like to have detail in my band it tells me that if the maker puts band with that much artistry on their cigars they are something I want to smoke.

  • talisker22

    In a cigar band I like simple design but something that has a clear point to it. Like a catchy design or letterhead would be idea. Of course the band has to come off easily! I prefer band at the foot of a cigar like Diesel Unholy Cocktail. Tweeted.

  • Tweeted

    I can appreciate traditional band designs; crowns and crests etc. but at this point I think its a getting a bit boring. I like what drew estate has been doing, the new branding for Camacho and Room 101 lines. But it’s always about great typography, bad type choices always makes sticks look cheap.

  • cigarnube

    I really love a band that has a royal looking crest with gold and red colors. I don’t mind the simple rectangular bands but I prefer big cool ones better. I shared on google plus

  • LV2HNT

    I like the designs , the textures and the graphics. But most of all I love giving a band to my grandson because he thinks it is a cool ring he got from papa. I can still remember my Granpa giving me a ring off his cigars when I was growing up.

    Shared on FB

  • Dale

    I like a band that actually has what cigar it is. AND one that I can actually read it. If I pick a single out of the cooler that is not in a box, on many I have no clue what cigar it is. That doesn’t work for me.


  • Fabbio

    I like the band to identify the cigar. I find this a big issue at some b&m at time sits hard to tell what the heck your looking at.

    Self adhesive is a must. I prefer only the band not 8 part davidoff special with the foot band and mid wrap and double tip band. The cigar doesn’t need a 4 piece suite.


  • jvonier

    I like a simple band that lets you know what you are smoking and is easy to remove when the time comes to do so.

  • Toolride

    Firstly…. shared on Google+

    Bands are just a “pretty ‘lil decoration.” As long as it is not gobbed with glue that damages the wrapper and is easy to get off… it’s just a pretty little eye catcher on the outside. Remember folks, can’t judge a book by its cover. The same goes with your smokes…. you can’t judge a good smoke by a pretty band.

  • PlatinumRespect

    Most of the time, bands are flashy and interesting to draw the smoker in. Not gonna lie and say I don’t fall for it sometime, but the band definitely does not make the cigar. In a band, I like to know what I am smoking. I want to know the name, and every piece of information I can to remember the smoke and be able to look it up in the future.

  • Randerson

    Simple, clean graphics, that are printed with quality paper/ink. Reasonably sized. Some of the larger bands just have to be removed right away to not interfere with smoking. Shared on Facebook

  • gumby_130

    If a band is something other than paper, it catches my eye. Other than that a band that clearly let me know what I’m smoking.

  • 987

    Gold embossed bands are the most appealing to me. I am interested in the bands that burn with the cigar, haven’t tried one yet.


  • jungjae510


    I like a band that is easy to take off and doesnt break the wrapper.

  • Craig

    I like a band that is pleasing to the eye. One that compliments the wrapper and doesn’t take away the beauty of the cigar itself. And of course as nearly everyone else has said, a band that comes off easily and doesn’t damage the wrapper. Liked on Facebook.

  • dwtate5

    Bryan what colors or designs do like?

  • phillyb

    Liked on FB.

    To me the band is really secondary to how the cigar itself looks. That being said the more a company pays attention to how its band catches the eye the more likely you are to pay attention. The standout features for me are that it has to be at least a little textured, like raised lettering or patters, and the brand and country of origin have to be CLEARLY legible. Color doesn’t really matter to me so long as they don’t clash horrifically. It so happens that my favorite band is also from my favorite cigar to date, a Santiago. Its a cheap stick at four bucks but the gold on black band is simple and very nicely done.

  • IBey

    Let me start by saying I am in no way linking the quality of the band directly to quality of stick. While it can sometimes be deceptive to the quality of experience the stick ultimately results in, the band none the less adds to the overall experience itself. Not only am I interested in the smoke itself, the visual presentation of the stick is a major part of this overall experience. Since this is about the band and not the smoke itself, I’ll try to limit my feedback to that. When it comes to bands, these are the things that I pay attention to…

    – Logo design: Most reputable tabacaleras who tend to put much effort into creating a quality stick, will make sure that their logo design also reflects the personality of the company. Those companies whose objective it is to be a mainstay in the industry, not only present a logo design that distinguishes their brand, but also compliments and conveys the attributes with which they want their brand to be associated. Think LGC, MF, Cohiba, AB, etc.

    – Series design: In addition to logo design, does the series design help distinguish this project in the brands product line? Think RP Vintage vs Renaissance or the various Man O’War and Oliva projects. Does the series design reflect attributes of the expected experience.

    – Color pallet, texture, and finish: Pretty simple. How does the overall presentation and finish of the band compliment the actual stick. The wrapper on the stick can be considered the suit, while the band(s) can be considered the accessories. If the stick has a nice sheen to it, does the band compliment it with a high gloss finish or a flat finish. If the wrapper is a nice dark maduro or habano, does the band bring in subtle or sharp contrasts which can hint to expectations of subtle or sharp changes in the smoking experience. Think CAO M2X maduro or Camacho 3x maduro.

    All in all, the band is a major part of the visual presentation which drives our expectations. Those brands who have done their homework well know that we rely on all of senses (how’s it feel in our fingers, how it smell, how’s it look overall) when deciding if we’re going to take a chance on their project.

    • IBey

      Shared on FB

  • krisausm

    I like a strong-medium sized-band with a lot of detail. An example of a band I don’t like is the Rocky Patel Connecticut. I just find it to simple, and it really doesn’t show me what the cigar is all about.
    The best example of a band that oI like would be from Gurkha. Their bands have so much detail in them. they have the raised lettering/details, the shiny metallic looks, and the badassness look they give.

    Hopefully you can see this picture I took 😀

    • krisausm

      I guess the photo didn’t come out -_-

      • krisausm

        OH! And I shared this on Google+

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